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Thread: Chronic sinus infections, bronchitis, and nasal rinses.

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeG-2012 View Post
    What more can I say to this other than a hearty "AMEN SISTER!!" Well said. Well said!!
    Only thing I would change here, is that it should be "AMEN BROTHER"! since me2 is Kirk, my relative neighbor geographically, as Weggies go, and one of the three Weggies I have met in person.

    I would also suggest that the type of arrogant doctor Kirk describes should probably not have been vets, either. Although arrogance in docs does appear to surface more when dealing with humans than when dealing with animals, who cannot attempt to offer ideas or explanations of their symptoms or how they are feeling. I suppose some vets could be that way with the human owners of these animals.
    Anne, dx'ed April 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by me2 View Post
    Well, since the MRSA- AAV thread was closed for some reason I will continue here with where I left off in that discussion. I would prefer to continue the discussion in the original thread but I can't.
    I apologize to others here if this thread is closed for the same reason- whatever that is.
    All I have seen is people trying to help themselves, people they care about and each other.

    When I was last talking to Blake we were talking about the use of iodine and Ponaris - which contains iodine.
    I had an appointment with my ENT the next day and while I was waiting in "the chair" to get scoped I saw a notice on his office wall about a study they were doing comparing just plain saline rinse, with saline and iodine solution and with saline and mupiricin solution. I didn't even have to approach him from the angle of the discussion we were having here on the forum I just asked about the study.

    They are studying the compared effectiveness of these different solutions in the control of staph in the sinuses. The concentration of the iodine solution is close to the same as the one Blake outlined. The form of iodine they are using is Povidone. Betadine is equal to 10% povidone-iodine. The direction is to put 2.5 ml in a Neil med bottle that is 240ml.
    This makes an approximate 1% iodine solution.

    The saline for all the options is to be made with previously boiled or distilled water. (I currently just use well water. So this would be different for me) . The rinse for all the options is to be done twice daily. The doc said I could do more if I wanted to and also suggested that if I did more that I could do the medicated rinse as the last rinse.

    My sinus was cultured as part of my visit and if I am found to have staph still in my sinus then I will participate in this study. I will report my experience and the results of their study here.

    I think it carries some real significance because of the unique problem that staph presents for us weggies. The doctor agreed.

    Part of the protocol for all of the options is to shower every other day with the same soap they use before surgeries. Chlorhexidine gluconate 4% . The thinking is that because staph is present on the exterior of our bodies we might significantly reduce colonizing our sinuses by extra exterior hygiene.

    How interesting that my docs were concurrently working on the same idea Blake and I were exploring right here. Think about the consequences of the pursuit of knowledge and sharing of information being censored and discouraged here on this forum.

    Of course I'm hoping I don't have staph right now but if I do - I'm part of the study and will learn more than by not trying anything.

    I had a long chat with the doctor doing the study and she was very interested the discussion we had been having here.
    Good doctors LOVE informed and interested patients who are making efforts on their own behalf. Bad doctors want to treat you like an animal that should never have a thought or opinion.

    Insist on having a good doctor. Don't settle for a doctor that should have become a veterinarian. Good doctors enjoy and embrace the fact that they have fellow humans for patients. They do not look down on them as if they are somehow superior.

    I feel very blessed that I have such great doctors right now supporting me on this journey. It has not always been this way. I have suffered suppression and neglect under the 'care' of arrogant vet-shoulda-beens. This is a wildly out-dated model of the doctor/patient relationship.
    Thank you me2.
    I thought I would post the original study that convinced me to try iodine on my mom's mrsa.

    Abstract

    Various commonly used antiseptics were tested against three strains of methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA) at stock strength and in serial 10-fold dilutions. The stock solutions of 4% chlorhexidine gluconate-alcohol (Hibiclens), 1% p-chloro-m-xylenol (Acute-Kare), and 3% hexachlorophene (Phisohex) produced 2-log reductions of MRSA after a 15-s exposure, but even after 240 s, these solutions failed to kill all the MRSA. Povidone-iodine (Betadine) solution was maximally effective at the 1:100 dilution, killing all the MRSA within 15 s; other dilutions were less effective, though each killed the MRSA within 120 s. Similar results were obtained with three different strains of methicillin-susceptible S. aureus. Thus, of the four most commonly used antiseptics, povidone-iodine, when diluted 1:100, was the most rapidly bactericidal against both MRSA and methicillin-susceptible S. aureus.



    Bactericidal activity of antiseptics against methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by me2 View Post
    This is very interesting. Thanks for sharing this. I have been on protonix for a LONG time due to GERD issues. I am currently working with my gastro doc to reduce my protonix dose. One large factor that the doc pointed out to me was that caffeine relaxes the muscles in the throat and contributes to GERD. So, for now I am stopping.

    Also, I have read that benzodiazapines can do the same thing. I think your mom used these too Blake? Unfortunately I have only been able to cut back on my use at this time. I use them for neurological damage caused by wg. I have hope that in time I can completely stop the benzo and hopefully lead to stopping protonix. Baby steps. LOL
    Hi me2,
    Tapering ppi's may be very difficult due to the rebound reflux caused by them.
    I will ask her dr when she is off pred if he has tapering schedule to get her off them if her GI scope comes out okay.

    Yes, my mom is still tapering valium. She had to cross over to valium from Ativan because Ativan is way too short acting.
    She has been tapering for 20 months and hopefully, be off by July of this year.
    Dr Heather Ashton is the world's foremost authority on benzo withdrawal and compiled a manual here
    benzo.org.uk : Benzodiazepines: How They Work & How to Withdraw, Prof C H Ashton DM, FRCP, 2002

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    I apologize to others here if this thread is closed for the same reason- whatever that is.
    The MRSA thread was closed because there was too much "doctoring" going on and suggestions or recommendations of treatments that could be harmful if attempted without consultation with a medical professional. You simply can not tell people that they should be putting iodine, boron, silver, plain tap water, peroxide, or whatever into their sinuses. Some people could be desperate enough or dumb enough to actually attempt the procedure without consulting their doctor first and could cause permanent damage, aka, the young lady who got the nasal rinse into her inner ear and caused an infection. Don't we have enough difficulties with this disease without trying home remedies or "stuff we read on the internet"? The internet is a good resource, but some people tend to get carried away and then it becomes damaging and harmful. Forum members need to temper what suggestions are made and how strongly they recommend a treatment unless you are a doctor and have a medical degree.
    Wegener's (​GPA )- dx Apr10, Granulomatous Hypophysitis - dx Apr10, Diaphragmatic Paralysis - dx Feb16, Bradycardia - dx Dec16. (my story)
    Forum Member Map -- world map for you to put a stickpin of where you are located....

  5. #25
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    Hey guys I am "the young lady" referred to in vdubs post. Altho i was prescribed the neil med rinse by my ENT, i do agree we have to be careful. It didnt do me much good. But i know some of you get relief from it. We definitely have to keep our heads together and make good decisions when it comes to this disease. I am so happy to be able to bounce things here. Peace everyone

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrtmeo View Post
    Thank you me2.
    I thought I would post the original study that convinced me to try iodine on my mom's mrsa.

    Abstract

    Various commonly used antiseptics were tested against three strains of methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA) at stock strength and in serial 10-fold dilutions. The stock solutions of 4% chlorhexidine gluconate-alcohol (Hibiclens), 1% p-chloro-m-xylenol (Acute-Kare), and 3% hexachlorophene (Phisohex) produced 2-log reductions of MRSA after a 15-s exposure, but even after 240 s, these solutions failed to kill all the MRSA. Povidone-iodine (Betadine) solution was maximally effective at the 1:100 dilution, killing all the MRSA within 15 s; other dilutions were less effective, though each killed the MRSA within 120 s. Similar results were obtained with three different strains of methicillin-susceptible S. aureus. Thus, of the four most commonly used antiseptics, povidone-iodine, when diluted 1:100, was the most rapidly bactericidal against both MRSA and methicillin-susceptible S. aureus.



    Bactericidal activity of antiseptics against methicillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus.
    As long as the solution kills the bad bacteria does it matter if it takes two minutes or 1/4 of a minute. I think studies will be most helpful if helps identify what treatment is most effective in preventing future infections or re-infections. These bacteria constantly evolve to become resistant to antibiotic treatment and what happens if they become resistant to the above chemicals too. That will be a real nightmare! we are at high risk as this article states.

    Should I Talk to My Doctor about MRSA Symptoms?

    MRSA skin rashes are spread through the resistant bacteria entering the body. While the bacteria known as staph is common and generally not harmful when on the surface of the skin, it can cause infection when it gets into the bloodstream through a cut in the skin. This form of bacteria has evolved as humans have overused antibiotics to treat colds, flu and viruses. Even when antibiotics are appropriately used to treat bacterial infections, they cause bacteria to adjust, making them more resistant. MRSA constantly changes, making it difficult for researchers to keep developing antibiotics that will effectively fight it.


    MRSA symptoms include areas of the skin that are painful to the touch, red, and swollen. MRSA skin infections can also look like spider bites or pimples and are filled with pus. If left untreated, infection can spread to the blood. As the infected blood travels through the human body, infection of the bones, joints, heart valves, lungs, and blood can occur, eventually leading to organ failure. Additional MRSA symptoms can include chills, a persistent cough, and a fever. Patients with compromised immune systems are at a particular risk for developing a MRSA infection, along with individuals who live and work in care centers, such as day care centers, jails, and retirement homes.
    Knowledge is power! Wisdom is using it to make good decisions!

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by vdub View Post
    The MRSA thread was closed because there was too much "doctoring" going on and suggestions or recommendations of treatments that could be harmful if attempted without consultation with a medical professional. You simply can not tell people that they should be putting iodine, boron, silver, plain tap water, peroxide, or whatever into their sinuses. Some people could be desperate enough or dumb enough to actually attempt the procedure without consulting their doctor first and could cause permanent damage, aka, the young lady who got the nasal rinse into her inner ear and caused an infection. Don't we have enough difficulties with this disease without trying home remedies or "stuff we read on the internet"? The internet is a good resource, but some people tend to get carried away and then it becomes damaging and harmful. Forum members need to temper what suggestions are made and how strongly they recommend a treatment unless you are a doctor and have a medical degree.
    Yep I would have to agree. There will be closer monitoring and moderating of people and threads for the foreseeable future.
    Forum Administrator
    Diagnosed March 2003.
    Currently but not permanetly residing in Canberra, Australia.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by im so blessed View Post
    Hey guys I am "the young lady" referred to in vdubs post. Altho i was prescribed the neil med rinse by my ENT, i do agree we have to be careful. It didnt do me much good. But i know some of you get relief from it. We definitely have to keep our heads together and make good decisions when it comes to this disease. I am so happy to be able to bounce things here. Peace everyone
    I don't think by using the NeilMed rinse, as recommended by pretty much all our doctors if we have sinus involvement, that you are in the same category with those who will put anything up their nose without consulting a doctor first. That you happened to get some in your ear, and it caused an infection, is an unusual occurrence. You were following a doctor's orders when this happened, as you said.
    Anne, dx'ed April 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by drz View Post
    As long as the solution kills the bad bacteria does it matter if it takes two minutes or 1/4 of a minute. I think studies will be most helpful if helps identify what treatment is most effective in preventing future infections or re-infections. These bacteria constantly evolve to become resistant to antibiotic treatment and what happens if they become resistant to the above chemicals too. That will be a real nightmare! we are at high risk as this article states..
    This is why iodine has been brought back as a treatment method against antibiotic resistant pathogens.
    Pathogens have not, to date, become resistant to the pathogens it kills.
    Iodine is not genetically engineered.

  10. #30
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    I got a call from my doc. I have staph and have been admitted into the study. I will be one of the people using the special soap in the shower and saline only rinse. I wish I had been in the iodine group but hey- this is science. You gotta be willing to make sacrifices.

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