Rapid Heartbeat With Exertion

[TOBEY32]

I expect some with exercise, but many (most) times movement (that normally wouldn't cause a more rapid heartbeat) does. Much more simpler movement: bending over or squatting down and then coming back up for instance. It's been this way since day one. With my hearing loss came the ability to hear my heartbeat (much more pronounced) in my ear.

Do you experience this?

David

[Al]

I'm guessing that the rapid heartbeat on exertion is due to anemia, David. With anemia, the bloods oxygen carrying ability is less, so you need more blood flow to get the required oxygen.

Dunno about the pronounced heartbeat with hearing loss. Perhaps there is increased bone conduction.

Al

[Pete]

I have similar symptoms to David's. My red blood cell counts have been at the low end of the normal range since diagnosis. When I was in good cardio condition, my resting pulse was in the high 60s, now it's in the high 80s, and exertion drives it up to the 130s or 140s. Fortunately, my blood pressure is well within the normal range at about 130/75.

Pete
dx January 2011

[drz]

My pulse used to increase just from bending over and tying my shoes or walking up ten steps. It got better as anemia decreased to close to low normal.

[Dirty Don]

David, I have had a similar set of experiences. The increased heart rate (I used to sit in the high 60s) has gone up into low 80s, not a big deal, but as Al says, it may be anemic reaction...doc doesn't seem worried. The 'hearing of the heart' is, for me, is due to an expanded Eustachian tube...it's a part of the feeling like I'm in a barrel when talking or hearing. I have some hearing loss, but not severe, mostly the screwed up E tube...it's very difficult to remedy by the way. Sit down, put head lower between knees or close enough...does the 'heart sound' go away or improve? If so, it's called autophony...again, tough to get rid of. Tends to go along with tinnitus too.

[annekat]

Yes, David, I have experienced both of those things. My doctor has told me I'm not anemic, but I've still had a high heart rate since the beginning of diagnosis, though it has come down considerably. Perhaps I was anemic at the beginning, combined with having trouble catching my breath after any exertion. The heartbeat in the ear thing comes and goes for me, and can change with head position when lying down. I know my eustachian tubes are messed up, and my hearing loss is pretty bad, but I don't think my tubes are "expanded" as Don says his are... I thought it was the other way around, that they were dysfunctional due to swelling and tissue damage which would make them more constricted and less likely to regulate pressure in the ear. There is so much about all this I don't understand.... I wish I could see an actual picture of what my eustachian tubes, sinuses, and other related things look like inside.

[Al]

Anemia can be pernicious, even if it isn't Pernicious Anemia. I suspect, Pete, that you have the same kind I have. For background, bone marrow, which produces the red blood cells, gets its marching orders from erythropoietin (EPO), a hormone produced by the kidneys. Distressed kidneys produce less EPO, so less red cell manufacture happens. This kind of anemia thus occurs for lack of oxygen-carrying cells, rather than a dearth of hemoglobin. (This is the reason that no amount of iron supplementation helps for these cases.)

Al

[TOBEY32]

Yes, David, I have experienced both of those things. My doctor has told me I'm not anemic, but I've still had a high heart rate since the beginning of diagnosis, though it has come down considerably. Perhaps I was anemic at the beginning, combined with having trouble catching my breath after any exertion. The heartbeat in the ear thing comes and goes for me, and can change with head position when lying down. I know my eustachian tubes are messed up, and my hearing loss is pretty bad, but I don't think my tubes are "expanded" as Don says his are... I thought it was the other way around, that they were dysfunctional due to swelling and tissue damage which would make them more constricted and less likely to regulate pressure in the ear. There is so much about all this I don't understand.... I wish I could see an actual picture of what my eustachian tubes, sinuses, and other related things look like inside.

Someone said just bending over to tie their shoes can start their heart beating - I can relate. And after just 1 set of something at the gym I have to rest.
I, too, thought my hearing loss was caused by some-what collapsed/shrunken e-tubes, but really don't know. My ENT had said in the past that my sinuses resembled "hamburger meat". Don't really know what food item they're supposed to look like...

[Al]

Yes, David, I have experienced both of those things. My doctor has told me I'm not anemic, but I've still had a high heart rate since the beginning of diagnosis, though it has come down considerably. Perhaps I was anemic at the beginning, combined with having trouble catching my breath after any exertion. The heartbeat in the ear thing comes and goes for me, and can change with head position when lying down. I know my eustachian tubes are messed up, and my hearing loss is pretty bad, but I don't think my tubes are "expanded" as Don says his are... I thought it was the other way around, that they were dysfunctional due to swelling and tissue damage which would make them more constricted and less likely to regulate pressure in the ear. There is so much about all this I don't understand.... I wish I could see an actual picture of what my eustachian tubes, sinuses, and other related things look like inside.Anne, you may not have anemia, as measured by RBC, HCT, etc. Your high heart rate might be a result of the meds, or something else.

Al

[Al]

...My ENT had said in the past that my sinuses resembled "hamburger meat". Don't really know what food item they're supposed to look like... (Sloppy Joes? Carne asada? Dried anch chilis?)

Al

[mishb]

My blood pressure is at a good level 120's/70's.

I have a rapid heartbeat which is always between 95 & 110
The doctors asked me about it when I was in the hospital last year and as it never went higher or lower than this range, (everytime they did the hourly obs), they said it was okay. They said that they would be worried if it just started doing it. My husbands is always around the 60 mark.
I figured I was unfit.

I too hear my heartbeat in my ears depending which side I try to lie on in bed, or yes, even when tying shoe laces. I've still just been putting it down to being unfit.

[Dirty Don]

"I don't think my tubes are "expanded" as Don says his are... I thought it was the other way around, that they were dysfunctional due to swelling and tissue damage which would make them more constricted and less likely to regulate pressure in the ear. There is so much about all this I don't understand.... I wish I could see an actual picture of what my eustachian tubes, sinuses, and other related things look like inside." -Anne

Anne, as I've had it explained to me, the E tubes actually are constricted and only open to regulate pressure on the 'inside' of the eardrum as needed, hence, gulping on an airplane flight or such relieves the seeming pressure thru expansion of the tubes. I HAVE seen the inside of my damn head/sinuses....in color even, on 3 screens at once EVEN! OMG! I didn't know ENTs had so many toys! LOL! It's a weird feeling seeing all that tissue so close up...and so close to my already tiny brain!! Haha! Anyway, the damage is evident once you see it. My E tube looks like a wind tunnel, literally...and the sinuses look pretty raw due to the WG damage left behind...sheesh...not sure I wanted to know all that, but is what it is! Gotta love technology!

[Dirty Don]

'(Sloppy Joes? Carne asada? Dried anch chilis?)' -Al

more like the red sands of Mars...

[Al]

'(Sloppy Joes? Carne asada? Dried anch chilis?)' -Al

more like the red sands of Mars...Yum! Tasty...!

Al

[annekat]

Someone said just bending over to tie their shoes can start their heart beating - I can relate. And after just 1 set of something at the gym I have to rest.
I, too, thought my hearing loss was caused by some-what collapsed/shrunken e-tubes, but really don't know. My ENT had said in the past that my sinuses resembled "hamburger meat". Don't really know what food item they're supposed to look like... I suspect my sinuses and e-tubes look something like yours.... the bony structures of my sinuses are somewhat eroded, according to my ENT, and the passageways between them are bigger that before, which he says means I'm less likely to have sinus infections but will still have big blobs of mucus collecting in there to some degree. He suggests having me make an appt. every couple of months to have him clean out the sinuses with a suction device. I have done this a couple of times.

[annekat]

"I don't think my tubes are "expanded" as Don says his are... I thought it was the other way around, that they were dysfunctional due to swelling and tissue damage which would make them more constricted and less likely to regulate pressure in the ear. There is so much about all this I don't understand.... I wish I could see an actual picture of what my eustachian tubes, sinuses, and other related things look like inside." -Anne

Anne, as I've had it explained to me, the E tubes actually are constricted and only open to regulate pressure on the 'inside' of the eardrum as needed, hence, gulping on an airplane flight or such relieves the seeming pressure thru expansion of the tubes. I HAVE seen the inside of my damn head/sinuses....in color even, on 3 screens at once EVEN! OMG! I didn't know ENTs had so many toys! LOL! It's a weird feeling seeing all that tissue so close up...and so close to my already tiny brain!! Haha! Anyway, the damage is evident once you see it. My E tube looks like a wind tunnel, literally...and the sinuses look pretty raw due to the WG damage left behind...sheesh...not sure I wanted to know all that, but is what it is! Gotta love technology! Thanks, Don. Maybe mine are expanded, too... I'll have to ask my ENT sometime. So I guess they'd just collapse on themselves. All I know is my eardrums are caved in, according to him, and there's not much that can be done about it. I don't fly on airplanes, so don't know what would happen. So, if my e-tubes were opened up to the normal degree, and not collapsing, I could hear? I'm still confused.

[annekat]

I too hear my heartbeat in my ears depending which side I try to lie on in bed, or yes, even when tying shoe laces. I've still just been putting it down to being unfit. I always thought this had partly to do with the carotid artery, which is near your ear, and the sound could intensify when you change positions, if the artery became more constricted due to pressure or being more constricted.

[annekat]

Anne, you may not have anemia, as measured by RBC, HCT, etc. Your high heart rate might be a result of the meds, or something else.

Al Al, I have attributed the high heart rate in the past largely to the condition of my lungs and bronchial tubes at the time... I was having trouble getting air, like having asthma. It can still happen if enough stuff from my sinuses drips down into the trachea or the tubes, and I'm having trouble coughing it up. But I think you are correct that the meds had a lot to do with it, too.

[Dirty Don]

So, if my e-tubes were opened up to the normal degree, and not collapsing, I could hear? I'm still confused.

Mmm, not sure on that Anne due to your drums already being partially collapsed. The E tube is strictly for adjusting air pressure inside the ear canal as there is no natural airway to that portion of the ear structure. So the E tube remains closed until the eardrum needs an adjustment to air pressure...hence, for those of us hearing heartbeats, wind, etc. the E tube is open more than it ever should be. And, it appears to be a difficult thing not only to diagnose, but also to rectify. ENT has tried a collagen like injection on mine, but to no avail. In fact, leaving in a few minutes to talk to her...maybe she's got something new for me. Aside from the disease itself, this has been my most irritating aspect! Jeez!

[annekat]

Mmm, not sure on that Anne due to your drums already being partially collapsed. The E tube is strictly for adjusting air pressure inside the ear canal as there is no natural airway to that portion of the ear structure. So the E tube remains closed until the eardrum needs an adjustment to air pressure...hence, for those of us hearing heartbeats, wind, etc. the E tube is open more than it ever should be. And, it appears to be a difficult thing not only to diagnose, but also to rectify. ENT has tried a collagen like injection on mine, but to no avail. In fact, leaving in a few minutes to talk to her...maybe she's got something new for me. Aside from the disease itself, this has been my most irritating aspect! Jeez! I thought the reason my drums were collapsed was because the e-tube was constricted and wasn't allowing air to fill that space and create the correct pressure in the inner/middle ear. I gather that normally "tubes" can be placed in the eardrums to allow air passage and equalize the pressure. But my ENT said this wouldn't work for me, and I assumed it might be because the ear drum is right up against the bones of the middle ear and they would be damaged. I'm not sure that my drums are immobile, as if I take enough pseudoephedrine, I can get my eardrums to pop a little by moving my jaw, but it doesn't make me hear any better. So, with your e-tubes being more open than they should be, are you getting air into your middle ear, or too much air, or not enough because the tubes tend to collapse from being expanded? I'm interested to hear if your ENT has anything more to say on all this.

[mishb]

I always thought this had partly to do with the carotid artery, which is near your ear, and the sound could intensify when you change positions, if the artery became more constricted due to pressure or being more constricted.

I have a doctors appointment in the morning (something about my last blood work coming back abnormal) so I will ask her about it then.

[annekat]

I have a doctors appointment in the morning (something about my last blood work coming back abnormal) so I will ask her about it then. Thanks, Michelle.... I just know I've had the heartbeat in ear thing from time to time since way before I knew I had Wegs or had much if any hearing loss. Nor do I think it had much to do with an elevated heart rate. I did searches on it where other people in the general population reported having it. Some said it was because of an infection. I don't really buy that there could be only one cause for it. I asked my PA about it a few years ago and she sort of shrugged like it was no big deal or she couldn't answer it. Same thing with some of the tinnitus we've talked about on here, notably the "roaring" sound; it seems that others besides Weggies have it, from general searches I've done, and I don't remember getting a definitive answer as to the cause. Mentioning this to doctors doesn't yield much of a response, either, though my Wegs-treating doc did acknowledge it as one supporting reason to slow my pred taper. Right now at this moment I have none of these things! But I still can't hear.

[TOBEY32]

(Sloppy Joes? Carne asada? Dried anch chilis?)

Al

You're making me hungry and grossing me out at the same time...

[mishb]

Thanks, Michelle.... I just know I've had the heartbeat in ear thing from time to time since way before I knew I had Wegs or had much if any hearing loss. Nor do I think it had much to do with an elevated heart rate. I did searches on it where other people in the general population reported having it. Some said it was because of an infection. I don't really buy that there could be only one cause for it. I asked my PA about it a few years ago and she sort of shrugged like it was no big deal or she couldn't answer it. Same thing with some of the tinnitus we've talked about on here, notably the "roaring" sound; it seems that others besides Weggies have it, from general searches I've done, and I don't remember getting a definitive answer as to the cause. Mentioning this to doctors doesn't yield much of a response, either, though my Wegs-treating doc did acknowledge it as one supporting reason to slow my pred taper. Right now at this moment I have none of these things! But I still can't hear.

Anne, I spoke to my doctor this morning and she said it could be a part of a tinnitis thing (I also have menieres). She said that vasculitis could cause it but that I should speak to my ENT next time I see him.
She didn't appear to be overly concerned about it.......more worried that my WBC, ESR & LFT's had increased this month

[annekat]

Anne, I spoke to my doctor this morning and she said it could be a part of a tinnitis thing (I also have menieres). She said that vasculitis could cause it but that I should speak to my ENT next time I see him.
She didn't appear to be overly concerned about it.......more worried that my WBC, ESR & LFT's had increased this month Thanks, Michelle... I still think in my case, at least sometimes, it has to do with a temporary change in blood flow near the ear, since it can stop if I change the position of my head. But other times, when it is steady and doesn't change, it is probably something else. I'll let you know if i find out anything more.

[Sangye]

Anne, you might have a misaligned vertebra in the neck causing that. See a chiropractor to check it out.

[Dirty Don]

with your e-tubes being more open than they should be, are you getting air into your middle ear, or too much air, or not enough because the tubes tend to collapse from being expanded? I'm interested to hear if your ENT has anything more to say on all this.

Sorry so long in reply....been busy! Yea! Anyway, yes, toooo much air as the E tubes are to remain constricted unless one needs to regain air pressure inside...there is no natural airway to the inner ear...google any ear pics. There is the opposite 'malady' of totally constricted E tubes that do not open enough when air pressure is needed, but that is correctible more easily than my 'always open' tube. Tinnitus is supposedly related to this, and I have had tinnitus for quite a while now, before WG as well as the E tube thing.

You also mentioned that moving your head into certain positions seems to relieve or stave off the 'heartbeat' thing too. There is an ENT test where the doc asks you to put your head between your knees (yeah, I know...jeez...but...), and leave it there for a few seconds, about 30ish, and if the sensation goes away, then it is highly likely one has 'autophony', in short, too much air in the E tube thus creating all the reverb of heart beats, air passing, etc.

Saw the ENT last week, she's done with me. The condition of my E tube is not correctible at this time, the injections didn't work. I asked about a procedure called 'blue tack' wherein the doc places what is simply a tacky substance on the outside of the eardrum She disdained this because although it may relieve the reverberations of the eardrum, it will also reduce hearing. Sheesh, no winning there...so I listen to my heart beat and pretend I'm near the ocean...who needs seashells?!?! LOL

[mishb]

Sheesh, no winning there...so I listen to my heart beat and pretend I'm near the ocean...who needs seashells?!?! LOL

I guess listening to your heartbeat is 100% better than the alternative :thumbsup:

[annekat]

Thanks, Don, for your explanation, again, of your e-tube situation. I'll have to ask my ENT next time EXACTLY what is going on with my tubes, eardrums, etc. I think it is the malady of constricted tubes vs. overly open ones. I do get the "roaring" tinnitus, which sounds like a wind tunnel, but it comes and goes and seems to happen more when I'm stressed, low on sleep, etc., and not seemingly in relation to my hearing. My ENT and audiologist seem to think my hearing loss is permanent, but then they don't know much about Wegs and the fact that some Weggies get theirs back. I also wonder if they are considering any surgical options or if they are dismissing that because I have low-paying insurance, or what. I'm going on Medicare in July, and don't expect it to be much better, but I might wait until that juncture and then try to see some docs in Seattle who are a bit more tuned in to vasculitis and Wegs. I do have one recommendation from a couple of people here on the forum.

[Dryhill]

(Sloppy Joes? Carne asada? Dried anch chilis?)

Al

Al, what are Sloppy Joes and Carne Asada?

Jim

[Sangye]

Al, what are Sloppy Joes and Carne Asada?

Jim

Dear heavens.

[Al]

Al, what are Sloppy Joes and Carne Asada?

Jim
Aw, Jim, you might as ask me about spotted dick and bangers and mash and other assorted pub grub. Sloppy Joes is ground beef, onions, and tomato sauce slopped onto toast of similar. Carne asada is, in mexican-ish cuisine, litterally "grilled meat". Neither is, of course, my cup of tea (nor would be bangers and mash), but it is a good (if flippant) answer to David's question....

Al

[Dryhill]

Aw, Jim, you might as ask me about spotted dick and bangers and mash and other assorted pub grub. Sloppy Joes is ground beef, onions, and tomato sauce slopped onto toast of similar. Carne asada is, in mexican-ish cuisine, litterally "grilled meat". Neither is, of course, my cup of tea (nor would be bangers and mash), but it is a good (if flippant) answer to David's question....

Al

Hmmmm interesting, I might just give Sloppy Joes a miss. I can understand your aversion to spotted dick but bangers and mash that is real food, but with good English sausages not the 100% meat American variety. By the way for pubs to survive now they have two choices:-

1. To have wide-screen tv and Sky (or similar satellite screening) and show all the big soccar matches.

2. Become a gastro-pub. Bangers and mash will definately NOT be on the menu, something sounding foriegn and laid out prettily is essential ........ oh yes and one should generally still feel hungry after the meal - your wallet may well feel as empty as your stomach!

Last week it was announced that 50 pubs a week are closing down. Hard times are here.

Jim

[Al]

Hmmmm interesting, I might just give Sloppy Joes a miss. I can understand your aversion to spotted dick but bangers and mash that is real food, but with good English sausages not the 100% meat American variety. By the way for pubs to survive now they have two choices:-

1. To have wide-screen tv and Sky (or similar satellite screening) and show all the big soccar matches.

2. Become a gastro-pub. Bangers and mash will definately NOT be on the menu, something sounding foriegn and laid out prettily is essential ........ oh yes and one should generally still feel hungry after the meal - your wallet may well feel as empty as your stomach!

Last week it was announced that 50 pubs a week are closing down. Hard times are here.

Jim
(Sorry, David--we have hijacked your thread yet again! Blame the ancho chilis....) I mourn the passing of the pub culture, Jim. On a personal basis, it allowed my youngest to avoid crashing and burning (he was bound and determined to fail in his American high school). He did his A levels at a boarding school in Bushey, where he was voted the "best bartender". His experiences allowed him to get into an American University (as a foreign student), which he never could have done on the expected arc.

And personally, the idea of a "gastro-pub" seems, to me, an oxymoron. Sure, there is plenty of traditional pub fare that I would never set tooth upon, but I never viewed food, or even drink, as the primary humanizing function of a pub. Good food is fine, but not at the expense of the institution's other qualities....

Al

Al

[skipper]

is anyone on aranesp injections to promote hemoglobin?

[pberggren1]

Never heard of it.

[drz]

is anyone on aranesp injections to promote hemoglobin?

Found this info on it elsewhere on internet: it was on a another forum for dialysis posting and i can't vouch for its accuracy but it sounds plausible. i haven't needed any epogen injections for over a year and half but it is still on my treatment plan if I get anemia down in single digits again.

Epogen, Aranesp, and Procrit all have the same active ingredient in them (it's called epotin alfa). They are different in the preservatives and maybe some other additives they use. Injecting epogen directly into you would be absorbed better only because you wouldn't be diluting it into the lines.

Some people also have a reaction to the different drugs (again, because of the preservatives). If you're used to taking the multi-dose version of epogen and then get switched to a single dose, you might feel a burning sensation. This is because the single dose doesn't contain the preservatives (which somehow numbs the body's reaction to epo).

I don't have much knowledge on Aranesp. but I would guess that if you could or would inject it subcutaneously it would work similar to epogen in a small amount.

I've also heard of studies about an additive that would make epo stay in the body longer and be absorbed better (thus less injections), but I can't remember off the top of my head what it was.

I understand that Aranesp has a three times longer serum half life than Epo, which makes it better for injecting into lines while Epo is better done sub-cu.
I also thought that Aranesp is darbepoetin A while Epo is epoetin A. I think that it is generally felt that due to the longer half-life, Aranesp can be given less frequently (every one to two weeks for example) and is more cost-effective, although if someone reacts adversely then obviously Epo would be the obvious choice.

[skipper]

I was just at my son's for brunch and when I got up my heart beat was so fast I thought I would faint. I know anemia and low blood pressure will do that but I hate the fact that I am so wobbly and fear of faining. I am told that this too will pass. I hear my heart in my ears as well. Too bad we all belong to the same club but it is "heartening" pun intended, to know I am not alone.. Skipper

[Al]

I was just at my son's for brunch and when I got up my heart beat was so fast I thought I would faint. I know anemia and low blood pressure will do that but I hate the fact that I am so wobbly and fear of faining. I am told that this too will pass. I hear my heart in my ears as well. Too bad we all belong to the same club but it is "heartening" pun intended, to know I am not alone.. SkipperAnother thing to watch our for, Skipper, is dehydration, which can lead to the wobbles and even fainting.

Al